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wordmuse
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What is velocity depth  
« on: Nov 4th, 2015, 3:18pm »
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In the Staff Instrument Editing dialog one of the parameters is Velocity Depth. What is this parameter and what effect does it have on the instrument. Is it related to the Volume parameter?
 
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bubu42
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #1 on: Nov 4th, 2015, 3:52pm »
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Apparently, it doesn't affect the way notes are typed (the standard velocity is 64) but it does affect the way the music is played. That is the maximum value HA will use when rendering the music. Setting the velocity range to zero will mute all the notes.
For example, if you set the velocity to 50 in the instrument edit box, then HA will not exceed 50 in velocities when the music is played, even if the notes have a 64 velocity when you edit them. Of course, if you leave it to 127, the notes will sound at the level indicated for each of them.
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wordmuse
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #2 on: Nov 4th, 2015, 10:13pm »
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I appreciate the answer. So just to be clear, the words velocity and volume in the dialog refer to the same parameter, yes?
 
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bubu42
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #3 on: Nov 4th, 2015, 10:46pm »
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on Nov 4th, 2015, 10:13pm, wordmuse wrote:
the words velocity and volume in the dialog refer to the same parameter, yes?

Not exactly...
Let's compare HA to a digital piano.  
If you hit the keys very hard, the sound will be louder than if you hit them softly. That is the velocity. The higher, the stronger the sound. In HA, the rage is 0 to 127 (64 by default)
Now, on a digital piano, there is an amplifier (+loudspeakers) and a Volume button that controls the output. Let's suppose you turn it fully clockwise : even a subtle movement on a key will generate a loud sound (of course, if you hit the note like mad, all the windows of the room may be blown off) In HA, the Volume is controlled for each staff (the little green triangle in the staff icon bar. Ctrl+T if it is not visible) with a 0 to 200 range.
 
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wordmuse
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #4 on: Nov 5th, 2015, 8:44am »
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Got it - I think.
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Andre_B
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #5 on: Nov 5th, 2015, 9:41am »
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I have used "velocity  depth" on the last choral piece I worked on, since the orchestral part was much too loud on the myr file I obtained.  
 
I understand that this is a capping, not a factor. I mean:  
 
If I set velocity depth to 15,  velocities up to 15 are unchanged, higher ones are set to 15.  
(If it was a factor, a velocity of 64 in the score would be played as 7,5).  
Am I right?
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bubu42
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #6 on: Nov 5th, 2015, 12:19pm »
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Quite right.
I hadn't thought of "capping" which I believed was only used in advertising, but that describes exactly that function.
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Andre_B
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #7 on: Nov 5th, 2015, 3:05pm »
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Bubu, I was writing in English... where "capping" and "to cap" are primarily used in a mathematical sense.  
 
For instance, a tax of 10% on a price may be capped to 1000 ¤.    
The French équivalents for "cap" and "capping" are "plafond" et "plafonnement".  
 
I did not know of "capping" in publicity, but found out. It's the same base meaning, and derived as a "French" word with just that meaning.  
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #8 on: Nov 5th, 2015, 3:17pm »
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on Nov 5th, 2015, 3:05pm, Andre_B wrote:
Bubu, I was writing in English... where "capping" and "to cap" are primarily used in a mathematical sense.

I can't stand maths, that's probably a good excuse for this lack of culture... Quote:

For instance, a tax of 10% on a price may be capped to 1000 ¤.    
The French équivalents for "cap" and "capping" are "plafond" et "plafonnement".  
I did not know of "capping" in publicity, but found out. It's the same base meaning, and derived as a "French" word with just that meaning.

Funnily enough, I happened to catch a glimpse of the very last line of your post and read "...Belge vivant dans le Gard". I could have written my answer in French as well ! As the saying goes, these days "J'ai une araignée dans le plafond !".  
« Last Edit: Nov 5th, 2015, 10:39pm by bubu42 » offline
muddle
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #9 on: Nov 5th, 2015, 8:30pm »
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Hmm, for what it's worth...
 I made a staff with a full range of velocities and the 'velocity depth' seemed to scale the output, rather than  act as just a cut-off at a certain level.
e.g. at normal 127 velocity depth setting you get the full output range, while at 64 setting you  get a scaled output that reaches up to that middle level, so that a velocity on the staff of say 30, will sound as 15.
 
So it seemed to my ear anyway.
 
Muddle.
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #10 on: Nov 6th, 2015, 8:04am »
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@Andre
 
Quote:
I have used "velocity  depth" on the last choral piece I worked on, since the orchestral part was much too loud on the myr file I obtained

 
As a matter of interest - did you try using the mixer to reduce the playback volume of individual orchestral staves in the choral piece you mentioned?
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #11 on: Nov 6th, 2015, 9:27am »
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on Nov 6th, 2015, 8:04am, Jeff1955 wrote:
@Andre
 
 
As a matter of interest - did you try using the mixer to reduce the playback volume of individual orchestral staves in the choral piece you mentioned?

 
Yes, that's what I first did. But I needed rather low values (around 5) that aren't easy to set (the same in many pièces and subpieces) using a knob.
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #12 on: Nov 6th, 2015, 10:57am »
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@muddle
I've just experimented on that velocity depth...
You are right ! It doesn't act as a cut off at a certain velocity but as a percentage applied to the existing velocities.
To avoid the side effects of having several samples for intruments like the piano, I set the instrument to sine wave. I used a recording software (target : digital output) and recorded the same sequence with different settings.
When the velocity depth is set to 127, the output volume matches the notes velocities (i.e. 64 sounds twice louder as 32, same for 127 and 64).
Now, I set the velocity depth to 64 (half value of the range). The notes having a 127 velocity actually sounded 64. That's why I first assumed there was a capping effect. But... when I set the notes velocity to 64 it sounded like a 32 velocity (half the volume on the recording software) If the velocity depth was just a cut off, they should have sounded like 64 (which was the maximum value in the velocity depth of the instrument setup), shouldn't they ?
I'll ask Myriad people about that, but I have a feeling that if the velocity depth is a sort of scale, not a cut off, it might be better to have a percentage instead of a figure ranging from 0 to 127 in the instument setup window.
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #13 on: Nov 6th, 2015, 3:12pm »
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Some more information straight from the source :  
In the instrument edit window, two settings must be taken into consideration at the same time : velocity depth and velocity offset.
 
From each note velocity (0 to 127), the programme will cut down the velocity to the depth set in the instrument edit window. Then it will add the velocity offset and the result is the velocity to be played.
 
An example :
offset = 32, depth = 50
The played velocities will range from :
32 (if the note velocity is 0) to 32+50=82 (if the note velocity is 127)
To find the upper limit of velocities, all you have to do is add figures.
Note : the depth may be negative, which will reverse the effect. For example : offset=127 and depth=-127 will entirely reverse the values.
« Last Edit: Nov 6th, 2015, 3:26pm by bubu42 » offline
wordmuse
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Re: What is velocity depth  
« Reply #14 on: Nov 7th, 2015, 5:02am »
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Good information - thanks a lot.
 
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